In this post I plan to respond to Kurschner’s issues presented in his short article. Kurschner teaches a pre-Wrath Rapture, which as he states it “shares some affinity with post-trib”.
Replies to the Post-Tribulational Rapture View
October 10, 2015 by Alan E. Kurschner
He states: “I have a book in the works specifically responding to post-tribulationism. I think there are some entrenched presuppositions in the posttrib framework that need to be challenged. Prewrath shares some affinity with post-trib, but there are important aspects in post-trib interpretation that fail to find biblical support. To name a few:
• The resurrection takes place in Revelation 20”
To this point I merely state that John’s explanation of the inclusion of Tribulation saints as part of the First resurrection in Revelation 20, does go a long way toward helping determine the timing of the first resurrection. It’s explanation to include Tribulation saints is extremely important. The same goes for the blowing of the Seventh or last trumpet described in Revelation 10 &11. The descriptive terms there help us to determine that the 7th trumpet is blown not in the middle of Tribulation, but at its end after wrath is poured out. This is especially true if it is realized that the seals and trumpets occur somewhat concurrently, but the seals seem to cover the longer span of history. The sixth seal helps explain what is occurring on earth as men begin to realize the truth of the church message and hide from Christ’s Coming.
• “The second coming begins in Revelation 19”
Actually the second coming begins in the air following Tribulation when it is dark, following Tribulation. The bride has made herself ready, how? Because she is stated to be so in Revelation 19 just before Christ’s Coming. This was accomplished in the body by her overcoming Satan and her own flesh through the blood of the Lamb and the word of her testimony as she ended well traversing the time of the Tribulation. Revelation 19’s depiction is only one of several depictions of the second coming event.
• “The second coming begins when Jesus physically comes to earth”
Exactly, it began in the air in Revelation 19; it continues on earth in Zechariah 14; it begins with His reign in Revelation 11; it begins with His presence in Revelation 6. All alluding to the same Second Coming and not to many different comings.
• “The seals, trumpets, bowls occur concurrently”
I am post-Trib. I would agree that the seals and trumpets are for the most part concurrent. The bowls however cover a short span of time either overlapping or joining the end of Tribulation and the second coming. It becomes obvious that it is necessary to be so, due to the early turning of water to blood. Without water man cannot survive 7 days much less 7 years. It certainly appears that wrath extends beyond the sighting of Christ’s Coming in the air and on into the initial few days of His setting foot on earth. I cover this at length in the book.
• “The rapture happens at the seventh trumpet”
The rapture happens following the first resurrection – For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord, will not precede those who have fallen asleep (1 Thessalonians 4:15 NASB). And yes the 7th trumpet is depicted as having the expected characteristics of this same event. For Messiah’s reign begins with the seventh trumpet. Therefore the second coming is understood.
• “Paul’s “last trump” refers to the seventh trumpet in the book of Revelation”
AMEN. It just so happens to be the last Trumpet in this age before His reign begins as stated there in chapter 11. There is no need for Paul, when writing concerning the last Trumpet, to have any awareness of John’s Seventh Trumpet, since all scripture is inspired by God’s Spirit. It amazes me that this argument is used by both the pre-Trib and pre-wrath teachers.
• “The great tribulation is 3 1/2 years long”
The length being 3&1/2 years is certainly not necessary. This is only important to mid-Trib eschatology, not post-Trib. The fact that Satan places his man the Antichrist on A throne according to Paul in 2nd Thess. 2, which seems to agree with Daniel’s timing concerning the abomination of desolation, does seem to be prophesied to occur at the 3 & 1/2 year mark and thus could align Satan’s wrath with what Christ described as being great Tribulation, but is it necessarily 3 & 1/2 years? – no, for unless the time is shortened no flesh would be saved.
• “The day of the Lord is a literal 24-hour day”
Again, I am Post-Trib and I do not adhere to a 24 hour Day of the Lord. In fact this day is the millennium for one very important reason. And I know that you are premillennial*. In Isa 13:9-12, He shall destroy the sinners out of it. Man will become more scarce that gold. This does not happen until the end of the 1000 year reign. It does not happen until the end of Messiah’s day. But this has nothing to do with a post-trib timing of the Rapture.
• “After the rapture, God’s people immediately descend to earth”
This is the teaching of post-Trib, because Messiah Reigns from the earth and we will reign with Him. And in fact we will be judged by Him when He returns. 12 “Behold, I am coming quickly, and My reward is with Me, to render to every man according to what he has done (Revelation 22:12 NASB). And we will be with Him to see His glory. 24 Father, I desire that they also, whom You have given Me, be with Me where I am, so that they may see My glory which You have given Me, for You loved Me before the foundation of the world (John 17:24 NASB). So, yes it certainly seems that we should be there with Him, having returned with Him.
“In the meantime as I work on this book, this link will take you to some important articles I have written in response to post-trib.”
He is writing a book, probably by now written, and has several articles written to prove that post Trib is incompatible with scripture, I may review some of those in future posts. As I do I will do more posting on his view.
*I know this based on your stand as follows:
“Prewrathers do not view the future parousia of Christ as some instantaneous, simple event. Rather, prewrath eschatology conceives the parousia as a complex-whole, where God will fulfill a variety of purposes, beginning with the revelation of Christ in the sky displaying his shekinah glory and power to the whole world, resurrecting and rapturing God’s people, followed by the day of the Lord’s judgments upon the ungodly and Antichrist’s kingdom, restoring Israel to salvation, and then culminating in Christ’s earthly reign for a thousand years, after which the final judgment occurs, including the elimination of death.” This taken from Kurschner’s article: Answering a Common Amillennial Objection to Premillennialism on When Death Is Eliminated in Relation to the Millennium